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I live in Las Vegas NV and I took the class because I've always been interested in the 'crows' that spend the night in my trees sometimes or that you see feasting on all manner of stuff when you drive through the desert to California. jThe first thing I learned is that all those guys aren't even crows they're ravens . . . And while we have plenty of grackles all over (which I knew about) and plenty of ravens it does not appear we even have crows around. I'm still glad I took the course because I like birds and animals even if they don't live close by.
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I summer on the west coast of Newfoundland and there are plenty of crows there. They gather in our yard, where I sometimes throw Cheetos, and around my small compost pile, where I put out mostly vegetable matter but sometimes fish skins. Watching them fly across the field, bright orange Cheeto cigars in their mouths is a delight. Our cottage overlooks the Gulf of St. Lawrence and the crows love to soar on the updrafts and winds along the shoreline dipping and floating and playing with each other. They seem to wait for us to arrive every summer -we've been going there for 10 years- and may even be greeting our return. They help make the whole vacation so much more interesting and fun.
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I live in Northern New York where ravens are on the edge of their range. I see more crows than I do ravens, and the difference in size is very noticeable. I notice that on the few occasions where I have noticed ravens, besides the size, the wedge-shaped tail is a strong clue as well. Crows seem to hang together in larger groups than the ravens I've observed. And they can be the neighborhood watchers and warners of "danger in our midst." Last spring a barred owl spent some time in our yard (much to our delight), but it was crows that badgered it loudly to ward it off and send the alarm. They were very persistent. Recently a bald eagle perched in a spruce, accompanied by a team of crows loudly making the call!
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I live I Sacramento CA. The map shows an absence of ravens there.
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I live in Nevada County in the foothills of Sierra Nevadas ..Nothern California .I have feed Blue Jays and Shrub Jays for years, peanuts .. ..Love how they mimic my calls..(another story) then watched at close range, 10 feet away a crow I caught eating out of the trash can.. .. we eyed each other.. at that point I was hooked, we noth were.. ..At that point they were not common, just a few so decided to try and feed them.. I live in a HOA so found a tree quiet corner that no one used and started calling them.. figuring out they were as talented as the Jays! Then started feeding them a little daily .. Within a short period of time they would call me , land on my deck railing looking for a morsel.. I underwent knee surgery so was bedbound home bound for weeks and Covid .. at that point could not distinguish individuals except for their calls ..but there was 2 that would land right in front on the only window I could see out, a small window where I lay.. Incredible that these 2 knew which window in my 2 storied condo .. Eventually I healed.. then was able to go outside.. ..the main 2 ..they pair up for life I believe would wait until I was at the kitchen window high up in a Birch tree (they love the tallest tree) and call to me .. sometimes 5-6 of them in one tree.. .. out I would go and feed them.. .They are very cautious because of their size.. .. I called them they would chatter and circle.. long story.. I eventually had about 60 a day in a few short weeks and a family of ravens .. .. I believe they dont rely on one food source but scope more than several daily .Im not home all the time too but a few days return .. there they are on my deck again .. . they have their 'routes' and the crow that calls me (and mate) is what I call a spotter '.. This got to be a problem in the HOA ,so had to relocate to a safer place away from homes , as many people see them as pests.. I watched about 25 of them being corraled by a red hawke one night.. They stayed in that tree above my home for nearly an hour it was nearly dark when they flew away, which was unusuall as they bed down early evening .. never seen then stay quiet for that long all huddled close .. The spotter and mate know my car , so will follow me occasionally down to the bank find a tree above my car and call me when I exit the bank..it makes me laugh.. If I had guests parking in my driveway, they responded like' who are you' .. and would warn me.. interesting as I told no one , but the guests would ask me 'whats with those birds in the tree above your home' I eventually told my neighbour .. she laughed.. What! ..she did not believe me ..A few days later this same neighbour drove me down to fill my car with gas ( I wasnt driving yet ) At a 'very busy noisy AMPM' she gets out to fill up and there right behind my rear where two large crows ..just landed..within 2 feet from my trunk .. It was sad when I had to relocate them.. very very sad.. they called and called.. but the HOA was not pleased .. They eventually left after a few weeks and then I found a new quiet corner an empty large lot with trees down the road about a mile away .. So when Im home I visit go down there ..call them and in they come circling the trees calling to me .. The Ravens barely move when I drive in and call them.. The spotter and mate are never far away .. interesting how they seem to eat something in the gravel drive ..is it a mineral? And just love to watch them 'kinda jump up quickly' when they eat.. have not figured that one out yet.. do any other birds do this?
Ive watched them around small flocks of birds , these wonderful creatures stay away from the ducking diving swooping of smaller birds . Its as if they are cautious of them because of their large size and not so nimble.. I have about 40-50 Crows and Ravens about 15.. although dont see them all together feeding as I did before
So happy to join this groupand read your stories
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3. I live in Laguna Beach, CA. I feed both the Crows and Ravens. I noticed the beak difference, definitely the size and the sound they make. I especially watch one big raven, guessing male...named him “big poppy”. He’s 3 times the size of any crow in the murder I feed. I noticed that the crows and ravens don’t really interact. The murder I feed is approximately 15-20 birds. There are two crows that actually mimic human sound. One clearly says “hello, hello” and we’ve had short conversations, the other makes a few different noises, not quite sure what he’s mimicking, but “hello” comes out at the end.
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1. I would say that a songbird nest predation study was done in 4 different forests via a video camera so it was easy to determine who was entering the nest. Over half of the predations were from squirrels (includes savage but cute chipmunks) and snakes (mostly in the south). Other predators include racoons, insects, cowbirds, jays, crows and 2 out of the 245 recorded predations were from deer. So not to worry about crows ravaging baby songbirds. Look out for the squirrels.
2. I can see a conifer tree from my bedroom that houses a crows nest. I have watched (and listened to it for years).
3. I live in the NW where we have both ravens and crows. I associate ravens with higher elevations in the mountains and don't know that I have ever seen them in Seattle. I do not know any difference in their behavior....is there any? Living in different ecosystems does not necessarily mean they have different behaviors. And yes, I think I can tell the difference now.
4. Raptors will prey upon crows so that is OK as they need to end too. If there are any animals that hunt in association with crows (wolves, coyotes) that is a benefit to creatures in the ecosystem.-
That is so interesting (to me) that you associate ravens with higher elevations Sally. I live in the Canadian prairies (above N Dakota) so elevation is not a topic around here. Even though they do exist in my area, I mostly have always associated them with 'the North'. I am ashamed to admit that I actually didn't realise they lived in the western States until I saw the map.
As far as different behaviours - my main distinction on that is that crows are gregarious and live in groups, whereas I believe ravens tend to be solitary.
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3. I live in the northwest of NJ. When we moved into our house, there was actually a pair of ravens that lived in our area. They have moved on... not sure where to. We could tell they were ravens by their size... if I look at one and think 'that's a BIG crow' I'll give it a second look and their calls. They were deep guttural sounds vs. the higher pitched 'caw'.
There is now a family of crows here, so I'm guessing that they don't 'co-habitate' well. I haven't seen the ravens in our yard since the crows 'moved in'. I do still see ravens in and around the area, but not often. They are harder to spot.
I'm kind of disappointed not to see the ravens anymore. We did name our house 'Raven's Roost'! It would be difficult to give up watching the antics of the crows though.
4. The other animals in the country-area I live in have definitely benefited. I feed the crows every day - just a little supplement, nothing major... so the other birds (including sparrows, blue jays, and even sometimes red-tailed hawks) and other animals (squirrels, chipmunks, and rabbits) get some left-overs. I only feed them in the morning so I know the food will be gone WELL before dark when we see raccoons, coyote, and bear... which I would prefer NOT get used to my feeding them. As much as I love them, I do have to take the dogs out in the dark so don't want these guys hanging out close to the house as much. -
I have seen firsthand the unpleasant experience of a group of Crows raiding some House Sparrow nest boxes that were put up in front of a shopping center. If someone came to me complaining about that, I would, of course, first be empathetic to why they were upset. I would go on to explain that it is nature-survival. The House Sparrows often kill and/or drive out Bluebirds from THEIR nests. Common cats, both domestic and feral also prey on crows and other birds.If a person wanted to prevent Crows from attacking nestlings in the nestboxes people provided they can do research on hole sizes and ways to keep predators out.
I live in Northeast FL and see Crows pretty much everywhere all year long. Have had the pleasure of having the same group/family come to my yard for several years. It became easy to distinguish individual personalities and my favorite part was when the youngsters would show up - just to listen to them learning to talk and watching them play with sticks and pretty much anything they could get ahold of. They are very adapted to visiting restaurant dumpsters as well.
Unfortunately I have only been ably to spot Ravens North of here in the Blue Ridge and Smoky Mountain areas of North GA>
As for benefits to other animals, I think they serve as lookouts for prey animals, not only issuing loud warnings, but chasing off the predators. When they scatter food about during eating, I'm sure other birds/small animals eat leftovers.
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I decided to sign up to this course in order to try understand crows better. We have a family of 5 crows that nest in the tall trees near us each spring. About that time I set out a large saucer of water on the deck railing for robins, cardinals, and other small birds to bathe in. They are fun to watch. But the crows don't just drink the water. They also like also like to use it to soak chunks of dry bread before scarfing it down. This makes the water very messy, and I have to change it. Also messy are the chicken bones. Ugh! Even worse, this past spring crows brought freshly killed fledglings and even - once - a baby squirrel, to rinse in the water. But now it is July, and hot. The crows have gone somewhere cooler, but the robins still appreciate a daily bath. We live in Arlington, VA.
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That's interesting Lita that the crows regularly use the water to soak their food. I have a bird bath in my back yard, and a little drainage pond in my front yard, and both are heavily used (for drinking and bathing) by all the birds, squirrels, and even cats in the area. I have seen crows very occasionally drink from the pond, but I've never seen them bring food to it. I wonder if there is something more enticing about your saucer than my bird bath or pond. Maybe they like that your saucer is more shallow? Hmm...I will have to experiment next summer!
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Interesting ehst they do with your water... Ive not seen them drink my water.. other birds just not crows ..the water also is on the deck so probably a little intimidating for that wing span.. .
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2 and 3: I live in Southern New England and have always seen plenty of Crows in the area. Sometimes, birders will report seeing a Raven on a local email site, but I've never seen a Raven here. I do occasionally hear a Fish Crow. It can be tricky to single them out from the calls of begging juvenile Crows, but Fish Crows' calls seem higher-pitched. I've never seen a nest. I really enjoy the behaviors of Crows. A few years ago I took a series of photos of a group of Crows feeding in my yard on Pears that were on the ground around my very productive Pear tree. A juvenile Crow was constantly begging with both voice and body movements (mouth agape, wings partly opened and trembling) following one particular Crow that was feeding on pears on the ground. At one point, the juvenile Crow tipped over on the ground, wings tightly folded closed, yet still with mouth agape and begging calls! The adult near it completely ignored it, even as it lay for severals seconds on its side, loudly begging. Such "drama"! Nice try! Their behaviors continue to fascinate me and I'm eager to learn more via this course.
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GREAT STORY! Destined for the stage.
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The pie chart of baby bird mortality is misleading. “Snakes” is a suborder-level taxon and “Squirrels” is a family-level taxon, while “American crow” is a single species. Of course the number of baby birds eaten by every possible species of snake is higher than the number eaten by a single species of bird.
A more accurate comparison would be to break down the “snake,” “squirrel,” and other groupings into individual species and see where the American crow ranks on that list. Alternatively, “American crow” and “jays” could be grouped together as “Corvidae” and compared to “snakes,” “squirrels,” and the rest. The exact numbers aren’t provided on the chart, but “Corvidae” would probably fall between insects and small birds as a cause of nestling mortality - not the largest cause, but not trivial either.-
Glad you made these points, Angela. For me, the important idea was the huge effect of chipmunks and squirrels. I had no idea they predated on baby birds, especially that frequently. I generally worry most about outdoor cats and raccoons where I live in Michigan - but we have lots of both chipmunks and squirrels. I know it's all part of the necessary order of things, but I get pretty attached to the bluebirds that nest in a box in the field next door.
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1 baby birds are a food source for many creatures, It would be interesting to put up a webcam and see just who is eating the baby birds.
2 I have seen crows in Albuquerque New Mexico
3 Where I live now there are only ravens
4. Owls sometimes use old crow nests for themselves-
Rosemary, I think the pie chart was based on using a webcam.
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I am responding to Topic 1. I would ask the neighbor if she had actually seen the crow killing the nestlings. If she hadn't, I would tell her that odds were that it wasn't a crow. Crows are opportunistic, and will eat baby birds if they come upon them, but it is much more likely that the predator was a snake, squirrel or raccoon, among other predators that eat baby bird much more often than crows.
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Owls can benefit by using nests that crows make.
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Crows give warning calls that alert other crows and also alert other birds and small animals to danger.
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After reading the responses to the question of crows eating eggs, it occurs to me that one should simply ask, "Do you eat eggs?" and smile sweetly.
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Good answer! They would probably say, "yes, but I would never eat songbird eggs". It's hard for people to see the hypocrisy because we put so much value on different species.
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1. I would say that, actually, it's probably a chipmunk or squirrel killing the baby birds.
2. I live in the city so any walk I take I'm likely to see 5-10 crows on it!
3. I do live where there are both species. I have seen a raven only once that I know of, at a bird sanctuary. They are enormous! So much bigger than a crow. It is easier to tell the difference between them up close.
4. Since crows keep insect and rodent population down, humans really benefit from crows! Crows also benefit everyone by spreading seeds and berries, so any animal who relies on seeds and berries would benefit.
BONUS: I love to see crows and when I get up close to them you can really see them as mini raptors. -
1. I would tell them that snakes, squirrels and chipmunks are the bigger predator.
2.ive seen crows in all my travels in North America. We have a nest in a old old cedar tree that they built this spring using twigs and dead grasses from our yard. It’s about 40’ up the tree.
3. Yes we have both species where I live and what I’ve noticed is the crows live in the residential neighbourhoods and the ravens tend to stay at the higher elevations in the mountains. The ravens are not nearly as social although they are curious when we go off roaring in the mountains. We have about 70 crows in the neighbourhood murder.
4. I’m not sure how the crows benefit other birds, but I know they live in harmony with my other backyard birds and are not as intimidating as I’d have thought after studinying them for awhile. -
1) I would mention that snakes , chipmunks and squirrels actually have higher rates of predation than do crows.
2) I don’t see many crows near suburban area where I live. Most likely to see single crows spaced out along highway shoulder especially in rural ares. Never suspected crow nest, but will start to pay more attention.
3) No ravens likely in my area. Have seen crows. Recently on vacation on Grand Manan island, off coast of New Brunswick and found groups of crows and also ravens readily found.
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1. I would tell my neighbor that our local squirrels and chipmunks are the more likely nest raiding culprits.
2. Last year there was a crow's nest in our neighbors tall pine tree. I enjoyed watching the crow couple's teenage crow assisting with the young ones.
3. Ebird reports crows and ravens in our area. I have not confirmed a sighting of a raven yet, it is one of my goals. We also have fish crows in our area - every dusk 50-60 birds or more fly from the lake/marsh area at our local county park, heading north. They occasionally land in a clump of trees, then is disagreement all take off again. They also work on flushing out all hawks in their path.
4. The crow is my bird watching companion in that he tips me off to any hawks in the area. Here in southeast PA we have nesting pairs of Cooper's hawks, Red-shouldered and Red-tailed hawks. The birds at our feeders take their cue from the crows, who act like the local sheriff in our neighborhood. -
4. Crows act as scavengers which is a very underappreciated job. I'm fortunate to drive through a 6 mile stretch of state land every day to go to work and I often see road kill. The crows, and other species, take care of this quickly so I don't have to see it for too long or smell it as it decays.
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3. in edmonton canada. i find crows take over the city during spring, summer, and fall. the ravens are typically found in wooded areas outside of the city. in the winter the crows leave (assuming south) and the ravens take over the town. often on cold snaps of -40 i will see ravens huddled around exhaust fans of the local 7/11.
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That's interesting Matt. I live in Winnipeg - which has a very similar climate to Edmonton - and the crows do not leave here in the winter. I have only ever seen a raven inside the city once (that I know of - quite possibly I wasn't able to distinguish before this course) - and it was yesterday (in the winter). I always thought we didn't see ravens in the city because they prefer woodsy areas, but maybe it is also because the crows don't leave. I will watch the exhaust fans at the local 7-11 over the course of this winter though...maybe the ravens are congregating there after all!
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There are hundreds of crows in our town. They roost in trees downtown and poop on the sidewalks, hitting people once I a while. Lots has been done to try to get them to roost elsewhere, but to no avail. The issue is especially acute in winter.
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1. I would tell the neighbor that the many snakes, squirrels, chipmunks, racoons and opossums in the area are the greatest threat to songbird nestlings.
2. A murder of 6 to 8 crows permanently reside in my rural gated community that prohibits discharge of firearms. I live above a bluff line that defines Cane Creek gorge of Fall Creek Falls State park. A pasture with small lakes lie above my property. On the end of my property with state park, a crow nest was built in the crotch of Black Oak some 70 feet above the ground. Three crows with much chatter tended the nest when the fledglings took flight.
3. I live on southern Cumberland Plateau (mid-eastern Tennessee) where the crows, vultures and raptors are common. The raven is seen east of the Cumberland Plateau along the Appalachian range.
4. A lookout crow sounds a warning to group of crows below that other birds and animals hear that a predator or human intruder has been spotted. -
1. I would have to point out that one of my cats is a formidable huntress. (She is dying to catch a crow, although they are larger than she is.) But the 4 ft rat snake, the squirrels and raccoons, not to mention the raptors and owls and cowbirds all have better opportunities to go after nestlings. The experienced members of the passerine flock nest in other yards. The crows do try it on though. The mockingbirds kick up an enormous racket when they or the blue jays show up... their nest is high in a hackberry tree.
2. I have never spotted a nest. The resident flock has a lot of hillside to choose from. The crows visit when I dump out feeders on the driveway or toss out stale bread, chips or fruit. They always go after the peanuts first, stuffing in as many as they can manage. The sunflower seeds must be stepped on while they are hammered. Then they have to practically lie their heads down on the pavement to extract the seeds. Usually, they come alone or with 1-3 friends.
3. There are only crows where I live. The ravens are a couple hundred miles west.
4. The crows and bluejays make a terrific fuss when there are predators around, including me. They seem to run regular patrols around the territory. I hear them calling from one side of the peninsula to the other.
I am told that they don't like to share space with grackles. There are certainly no grackles, (and not many blackbirds or starlings) on the ridge and peninsula where I live, but I have seen them foraging side by side at a nearby golf course, so that may just be hearsay. Not having grackles leaves more food for everyone else.
Anything that eats grasshoppers helps the local herbivores.
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